Ann

Are you still trying to wrap your head around this adolescence thing? Still troubled by the irrational behavior, the moodiness, the interest in things you think are ridiculous.

Well, in case you haven’t figured this out yet, you are not alone. Teenagerhood is as confounding to your teens as it is to you and every other parent and teen out there.

But it really doesn’t have to feel this way. If you’re willing to open your mind and learn how this developmental period can actually be a discovery process and an opportunity to more deeply connect with your teen, it can be truly rewarding and provide the foundation for your more adult relationship with them.

Today I’m talking to Dr. Mercedes Oromendia about some of the basics you need to understand about interacting with your teens, so stay with me.

This is Speaking of Teens, the podcast that that teaches you the science of parenting adolescents so you can be less stressed and more excited about having a teenager. I’m Ann Coleman, I’m an attorney turned parent educator and I’ve spent years studying the science of teen behavior and how to parent teens for the best possible outcome.

Dr. Oromendia is a trilingual/bicultural psychologist with expertise in parenting, children & families, and trauma. She knows the deal with teens. And, in addition to her private practice, she’s also the Chief Clinical Officer at Manatee. If you’ve never heard of it, Manatee is really cool – it’s an online mental health company for kids and families – it’s sort of a mashup of therapy and tech.

I started by asking Dr. Oromendia what she felt parents need to know about adolescence as it starts around 10 to 12 years old and what mistakes they often make at the outset.

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

The first thing, I don't know why we give it such a bad rep. That's my number one issue with it. If you look at movies or if you hear parents talk, oftentimes it's, oh my gosh, my kid's turning 13. It's like they're gonna turn into a pumpkin. Something is gonna happen and I'm dreading it. And this fear that parents feel, kids feel it too, right? And so parents might pull away or they might become overprotective.

 

and that causes a reaction. If you're expecting your child to misbehave, they're probably gonna misbehave. So really being thoughtful of what's coming up for you, it's, you know, adolescence can be very difficult and also it can be a time when you find out a little bit more who your kid is. What are they interested in? They start being more human in a sense and they have their own interests and their own passions and if you can get behind, you know, oh, you love K-pop.

 

What do you like about K-pop? Like, let me, sure, it might not be my passion, but let me understand, like, what is it? And you can get into it too with them and they can start teaching you about their world. There's a lot of things that teenagers experience that they keep from parents and oftentimes, it's because they don't think the parents care, really. But if we can really sit next to them and not.

 

Ann

Yeah. Well, and a lot of times we judge it. Yeah, we're very judgy, I think. We're very judgy about their music and the things that they're into.

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

We tried it, yeah.

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

Yeah. So actually, you know, to your correct to your question, I would love for all of us to journal. Remember what it was like to be 13, 14, 15. Really think back, connect with your inner adolescent. What was it like for you when you were that age? What when did you feel most supported and seen and connected with your parents or with other grownups in your life?

 

When did you feel really misunderstood? When did you feel comfortable in who you were? Maybe you didn't, most of us feel really awkward. Your body's changing, your social life is changing, there's sexual attraction. It's just a complicated time for teenagers. And so really connecting with that too, instead of seeing it as a scary time and seeing it more as, okay, we're gonna do this together.

 

Ann

Yeah, yeah. Well, and I think parents too, they have a hard time having that connection, that empathy and remembering, because I can't remember 13. All I remember about 13 is how horrible middle school was. I remember all the horrible stuff. I don't really remember exactly how I felt, but I think parents have a hard time being empathetic with that age. They just want the outward behavior to be like they want it to be, and they have no empathy for what is happening to a teenager.

 

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

And teens pick up on that. And if you think about a boss that you have, when they don't care what's going on for you at all, and it's just, I care about you producing and following the rules, but I'm not really gonna listen or empathize with what's going on. It doesn't make you feel, you know, just want to work with your boss on anything really, just makes you more contrarian usually, or you shut down. And then we wonder why kids don't tell us, you know, how was school, whatever. Well, we do actually aren't curious. So the first thing I would say is just let's be curious. Being a teen is a weird time and we can get weird with them, right? And so what can we learn about their world and get into, you know, social dramas really important at this age and they're learning to navigate and what their role is in these arguments or how they're making friends. It's a really, you know, talking to them about their friendships and having them talk to you and listening even though it might not be the most convenient time for you. That's another big mistake I see parents make which is, okay, we're going to have a conversation. Come sit down. That's not how it works. That's not how we work either. It's not on our own time. It's not on our own schedule. So knowing your child, right? If they're more of a night owl, maybe the conversations happen at 11 p.m. when they're getting ready to go to bed.

 

They just start chatting a little more and start telling you, sure, maybe you'd rather go to bed at that time. But remembering that the goal is to connect and understand and be curious. So those 20 minutes that you stay up chatting with them about what's going on for them will pay off in dividends. That's really where the relationship is built or driving them to somewhere, right? And oftentimes kids will talk more when you can't. They're not face to face.

 

Just like actually we will too, ask any Uber driver. They always share with me how people confess these big secrets to them, because you don't have that intimate eye to eye contact. So being mindful of that, when is your child talking? When are they opening up and following that and prioritizing that over your own to-do list? And that's not easy to do, but just remembering the priorities, that connection and understanding is gonna really make a difference in the long term.

 

Ann

What is it about that connection that makes a difference? I mean, what does that do for us? Because I know a lot of parents, the connection they feel is gone because the kid is pulling away at this age and they're in their room all the time or they're with friends all the time and the parent feels like there is no connection. But so what is it about that connection that does a parent good? And how can they have that connection when the kid is like, you know, acts like they don't want anything to do with you at this point.

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

You know what? That's a great point. And the connection looks very different in adolescence. It's not like when there are toddlers and you're holding them and, you know, they want to jump up and mommy, I love you. And they're on your lap and crawling all over. And you might actually need some alone time. You know, like I'm touched out. This is a lot. And now you just want a hug from your teenager. And you're like, this is the hardest thing to have. So when you connect, you know, if you think about your own life, I love bringing it back to your own life. When do you feel connected with someone?

 

And it might not be that you talk all the time with them, or they know everything about you, but when you do talk, they're listening. They see you. They might remember what your favorite food is. So maybe when you go to the grocery store, pick up their favorite snack, or say, hey, I know you love sleeping in on Sunday morning, so I was extra quiet today, or I kept your younger siblings quiet so you could sleep in a little bit more. It's that I see you.

 

For teens, they are supposed to be more focused on their social life and their own world. Teenagers become very self-centered and not in a negative way. Developmentally, this is what's supposed to happen. Right, so I wanna be very clear. This is what's developmentally appropriate, but it's hard as parents. Because suddenly, it's more like a toddler. In many ways, the brain can look a little bit more like a toddler, because they're really focused on what I need in this moment and reactive sometimes. So for us, if we can connect, we can help them regulate a little bit more. And connection again, can just be like, hey, I see you want some alone time. That's great. I love you. Let's talk later tonight. Cause what happened is not okay. I'll give you some time to calm down. And then we're gonna talk about this. And then you're still staying connected.

 

Ann

Yeah. Yeah, I see parents. Right. Talk to the moms and dads both that feel like their kid, and I see this all the time and some of the groups that I'm in, because their kid is so self-centered at this point and it is developmentally appropriate, but parents take this as, I see people calling their kid entitled or

 

Gosh, they don't ever thank me for anything. I bend over backwards and I do everything for them and I get no thanks and all these kinds of things. How do we get it through our heads that is just part of it? And I mean, it's hurtful. It can be very hurtful. They forget about your birthday. They don't tell you thank you. So how do we flip that in our heads? Or can we?

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

Yeah, or yeah, and the other one that I hear a lot is manipulative, right? My kids being manipulative. Like they'll be super sweet and say all the right things. Those words to me are like, uh-oh, something deep is happening. Because if you feel like that about your child, they feel it. There's no question about it. And so one, it's good that in your groups they're talking about it because that's number one, recognizing it. And it is hard. Part of it is...

We, you know, the earlier we can start working on this, the better. It's not really about you, but also you have to set your own boundaries. So what does that mean? What does that mean? Of course you're gonna be sad if someone doesn't wish you a happy birthday, right? That's normal. So there's something called natural consequences that are also really important. With anyone, it doesn't mean that we need to give...teenagers a free pass to be mean and be hurtful to you. But it also doesn't mean that we need to be reactive with the teens because if we are, we're just teaching them to do exactly the same thing. We can't hold them accountable for something we're doing, right? So what that can look like is, let's say they don't thank you for getting their favorite food. Back to that other example we were just talking about.

 

You go to their grocery store, you get them their favorite snack, thinking like, Hey, look, I got, you know, I got you the, your favorite hot Cheetos. And I thought, you know, here you go. And they grumble, like whatever.

 

And you say, oh man, and you could just model for them. Like, oh man, I'm disappointed. I thought this was gonna be something that made you happy and I was thinking of you. I don't think I'm gonna get a snack next time if this is, it seems like it's not something that's important to you right now. And then you don't, right? So the natural consequence, and you're not saying it in a blaming way, it's just the natural consequence of not showing gratitude because I'm not gonna do it again in the future for a while, right?

We always wanna’ give them chances. But it's important to be able to also hold your own space. We don't have to put up with everything that our child says or we can't say like, right now the way you're talking to me, I'm not gonna allow it, I'm gonna step away. We can finish this conversation when we're both ready to be respectful with each other. I don't let anyone talk to me this way and then you come back. I love you, but I don't want to say or do something that I'm gonna regret.

 

And so then you come back when you're both more regulated, but being able to really protect yourself, not protect, protect makes it sound like it's you against them, right? But just teaching also how to set your own boundaries. And what are the consequences if you act, if you're rude, if you're mean? There are consequences.

 

 

Ann

Right. Do you think parents understand that the way the teen acts, I mean, because it's kind of that's their default mode anyway. I mean, they really are there because of the way their brain works. I mean, they're usually or default mode grumpy or grumbling or negative. And do you think parents understand that is part of, you know, how their brain is changing and you know,

 

to kind of have a little empathy for that? Or do you find that most parents don't understand what's going on and that they're just being a butthole?

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

Yeah, I think most parents forget what it was like. Right? So I have the luxury, I have a younger sister, it's 10 years younger, and I remember when she was, I don't know, 15, and she was, we were all having dinner, and she just started crying. And, and you know, I asked her, I'm like, what's going on? What? She's like, I don't know, I'm just crying at her tears, right? It's just the emotions, the hormones, and it just exemplified. And

 

She just didn't understand what was happening and she couldn't even label it, right? What was happening for her. And that's oftentimes how we feel as teenagers. You're angry and then you regret it. And you say something, you don't like who you are. You don't like how you're acting. And you can't, if you could change it, you would and you don't know how. So it's being able to have that empathy with teenagers and find the moments you do enjoy them, right? So maybe...you can find some laughter in the grumpiness and have a shorthand with them and be like, you know what, your brain right now is really going into negative. You're reminding me of Oscar the Grouch. One way that I learned that can be helpful is if we point it out together. Can I just, you know, make a face? Can we have a code when I notice you're a little grumpy and then you could check in? Would that be okay? And usually if you ask them, then you know, you're not teasing them. It's a teaming again together.

 

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

It's that relationship. And then the second part is, and you know what? You tell me when I'm doing it, because I realize sometimes I go really negative too without realizing it. So can we make it into you help me, I help you.

 

Ann

That's a great idea. Yeah. Well, and that's, you know, when they get, when they get grumpy like that, it's hard not to be reactive as a parent. And you know, that was my big issue was not to go into lecture mode or scolding mode or, you know, start an argument. So, I mean, do you find that parents, um, understand their own, you know, emotional triggers and, and how to...

 

Ann

deal with those things, how do you help parents understand that part of it?

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

It's hard to generalize, but I would say no, but we're getting better, right? So if we think about when us as parents, when we were raised, there wasn't a lot of talk about mental health in general or triggers or just inner experiences. Now what we're finding actually, kids are asking for therapy before parents do. So where I work at Manatee, we have kids asking for therapy and then the parents are like, oh, well maybe, and the parents are the ones that are reluctant.

 

So that's good, we're seeing the shift. But for what that means is that parents, we have some catching up to do. We need to really work on our own stuff. It makes a really big difference and it's never too late to start. Ideally for me, you find out what you're expecting or you decide to start a family. Yes, you go, you do your own inner work, you work on how you are parented, what kind of parent you wanna be.

 

Can you strengthen your co-parent relationship with your partner, all these things. Most of us don't have that privilege to do it, you know, before we even have a child. That's okay, it's never too late because you're gonna be a parent forever. That's my other kind of pet peeve. I meet with parents sometimes and they're like, I, you know, they'll turn 18 in three years, so I'll be done. I'm like, what? No you misread the fine print here this is not you're never done and but that says to me how they're feeling about parenting right how they're feeling about the relationship and there's a lot of work to be done it's not hope hopeless but we need to really start addressing that now so for parents going back to your question i think it's important to just check in what's happening

 

Partially to has to do with a child right with your teenager in front of you a lot of it is what happened to you How were you raised? What what values do you have what type of attachment style do you have? Do you how do you tolerate being told no, how do you tolerate rejection? Right. Let's say if you have an anxious attachment style where you tend to feel disconnected from people you might read neutral interactions as they don't like me, something's wrong with me, and let me just go. And the way you respond to that is, I want to be more connected. I want to be there with you, right? And don't leave me, please. I want this connection. Well then when you have a teenager that he or she might shrug a little and be a little aloof and suddenly you guys would share everything together and you knew everything, all the little gossip and details of what was happening in elementary school and suddenly...

 

You don't know that much. That can feel like you're being rejected, right? And that can feel like, send you into a panic of they don't love me. I did something wrong. I'm a bad parent. Oh my God, I'm never gonna be close to them again. And it sends into the shame spiral and now you're reacting out of fear and shame. And your child picks up on that and the likelihood of being able to connect through that is much harder.

 

But if you can stop and say, and start noticing, oh, I respond this way when my husband doesn't pick up the phone too, or when my friend didn't respond to my text message for a week, ah, mm-hmm, this is, I need to own this, this is part of me. What's going on for me? How can I take care of myself? And trust also that I can build a strong relationship with my teenager, right? They might be a...

You know, we call it in my family, PITA, pain in the ass. That's okay, right now. And, but how can we reconnect and find those moments of connection?

 

 

Ann

Yeah, I think that is the hardest thing for a parent to understand to get because I didn't get it for a couple of years when I was going through this. I didn't get it that it was that it was how I was showing up and how I felt about myself and how I was interpreting his behavior. You know, it was it was more me than him. So you know, I don't know. I don't know how we

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia (30:46.04)

Mm-hmm.

 

Ann

get the word out to the masses, which is what I'm trying to do is to let parents know, it's not just the kid.

 

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

Isn't that really the case with every relationship though? It's not just with your child. Your child brings up all these very, I mean, they're great at those buttons, pushing those buttons. But that's the same way with romantic relationship, with work relationships, with your siblings. There's a reason why we respond differently to the same person. We have our own viewpoint and our own experiences that that show up and we have our biases and our tendencies. And that's why it's so important to do your own work and also do this, to be honest, to talk about it. Right, to be able, because the other side of this is what we see usually is, oh my God, being a parent is great, everything is wonderful, or the other side, now I have a teenager, oh my God, this is horrible, I hate it, nothing is good.

 

And that's not true either. So finding both, right? Like having a teenager is difficult because of these reasons. And I also really enjoy these other things about having a teenager. And this is what I'm doing to learn how to parent through this stage, because it's very different.

 

Ann

Yeah, you know, a lot of the parents that I see and that I talk to say that they, you know, they feel very alone in the struggles that they have with teenagers, that they don't see other parents, you know, they don't see other parents talking about it. They don't hear them talking about it. And I think that's a really big problem because everybody wants to hide, I think, the fact that they're having issues with their kid or that they don't feelyou know, capable or they don't feel like they're doing a good job. I mean, do you see that from your point of view when you're working with families? Do they feel like they're the only one that is having a struggle with their teenager?

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

Oh my gosh, yes, absolutely. And when I say, almost all of my patients, at least once have said, I didn't realize it was gonna be this hard. Sometimes I wonder if having kids was the right decision. And when they say that to me, they're full of shame. I'm like, oh, that makes sense. And you could just see the change. I'm like, oh, we need to, I'll be talking to each other. Of course it makes sense. This is hard. You're not.

 

And it's beautiful and right it's it can we know that there's a lot of wonderful things about being a parent too but it can be really difficult especially during the difficult years that your child might be going through right now.

So it's really important to be vulnerable with people.

 

Ann

Yeah. The other issue you mentioned, well, this triggered something in my brain, but when my husband and I were going through this with our son, it was me that I was the one that was pushing the wrong agenda. My husband was more, he really kind of knew what was going on and he was more laid back. Do you see that a lot with families that the mom and the dad are not on the same page with the parenting style and

 

I'm assuming that's maybe what you kind of try to do with these moms that, you know, before they have children that the parents try to get on the same page with how they're gonna be. But I mean, is that a big issue? Because I would love to have somebody tell parents how do you align, you know, with each other? And how do you try to, how can you get on the same page if you're not on the same page?

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

Yeah, exactly. And when you add, you know, maybe you're no longer together, it adds a whole other layer of challenges. And, cause then you have even less oversight, let's say. It is hard. And it's also not necessarily bad for a child to have different parenting styles because each child can learn different things from different parenting styles. So it's not that one necessarily is better than the other as long as we're rooted in respect. That's the thing that we forget sometimes is the importance of respect with our spouse and with our kids and with ourselves. That's why if someone, let's say your teen is swearing at you or being really disrespectful, that's when you're like, this is disrespectful. I'm going to step away because I don't let anyone talk to me this way.

 

So again, that respect. I'm not going to talk to you that way. Now it's important that you don't. That's where you need your own coping tools to not be mean, not label your kid. You're so lazy. You're such a X, Y, Z. But that respect goes a long way. So if both parents can have respect, there's going to be different ways of handling it. And it's going to take negotiation. But being able to explain to the child, you both have different ways and trying to come up with some guidelines for the whole family, right? So let's say if you agree that a big one that I see now is weed. Depending on the state, it's legal. Is it really that bad? Is it, right? And so can your teenager smoke weed or not? Or drink alcohol in a home. We know alcohol is.

 

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

illegal under 21, but many parents are okay with their child drinking it in the home. Many parents are not. So, agreeing on those rules, yes, that is very important to not go behind each other's back to disagree. So those ground safety rules are important to agree on. Another great thing is to agree on the ground safety rules.

 

And send them, because oftentimes it falls on the moms to do a lot of the research. And that's not really fair either. And then, you know, so really empowering the dads, hey, take a look at this and then we'll just, we can talk about it. But here's what I found. Let me know if you find something else that supports their position, right? Like here's why I think it's important that they don't or that they do X, Y, and Z.

 

Ann

Yeah, and have those conversations before it comes up with a kid. Oh, yeah, before it comes up with the kid too, because that, yeah, that think that's what happens is the kid brings something up and then both parents try to chime in at the same time. And neither one of them have talked about it with each other. And then you have this, the kid getting something from, you know, something different from each parent.

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

Is that helpful?

Oh my god, yes.

Mm-hmm.

And then you get good cop, bad cop. And it is completely great to tell the kid, you know what, that's a great question. I don't think Pama and I have really thought about it. I wanna make sure we're on the same page. We're gonna come back to it. We're gonna talk about it and then we'll give you. And then you have that conversation not in front of the child. You can discuss as a united friend. And it's an experiment.

 

You don't know what's really bad, right? You're trying different things that you can say to your husband too. Like, hey, let's give this a shot. If we're going to try this for a month, then we're going to see how that works. And then if it doesn't, right? But again, you're partnering together. It won't always be your way, but it won't always be their way either. So really seeing it as a team that we're going to get, you know, we have this together.

 

 

Ann

Yeah, I think that's so funny. I mean, I always say, you know, adolescence is this great big science experiment, really. So you just have to kind of step back and just take it one day at a time and try different things and see what works. But you mentioned something a minute ago, I want to I want to touch on too real quick is respect. So you know, a lot of parents get hung up on the on the respect for me respect for me. But then in, you know, in return,

 

 

Ann

they don't give a lot of respect to their teen. So can you explain maybe what you mean by you know to respect them as well as you know us expecting respect?

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

Yeah. So when only one party gets respect, it's more fear. It's not respect, right? It's obedience. It's not respect.

 

And that's a very big difference. Respect is, hey, I see you. I see who you are as a person. I'm gonna respect that you have different likes, dislikes, desires. I'm still the authority, right? So I'm not saying like, hey, let them do whatever they want. But I'm gonna respect you. That means no name calling. Even we cause so much harm to kids when we say you're the blank one.

 

We put those labels, sometimes they're even positive labels. Oh, even for teenagers, sometimes parents will say, oh, she's the good one or the shy one. Or she's, he's, I mean, I've heard so many parents that he's an asshole, he's selfish.

 

Is that really, is that respect? Where, what is that child going to do? They're gonna act like that. They're not gonna listen to anything you say because you're not treating them with respect.

 

Instead you can say, you know, yeah, he's really struggling right now to make, you know, some of the decisions he's making he regrets later. So we're working on that, trying to have less decisions he regrets. You're saying the same thing, he's impulsive and making some bad choices, but you're really partnering with him, right? And seeing, or you could say he's going through a really hard time right now and man, some of the decisions he wishes he could take back and we're working on the consequences of that.

 

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

because some you can't really take back once you make them.

 

Yeah, and sorry, respect is what you say and also like...

Trust, right? A big part, and trust is earned, of course. Once they start, and I know that, so once they start lying or hiding things, and you could say, hey, I want to trust you, we're gonna work our way back up to trusting you like it was before, it's gonna take some time. And here's what we're, you know, meanwhile, I'm going to get all the text messages you sent, or you won't have access to your phone, or I'm going to drop, you know, take you to school.

 

because I lost that trust that you're going to go to school when you say you are. But I think you can work on it and you can get it back. So it's seeing the kid for what it is. Like, I know you really want your independence, too. I get it. We're going to work on that, too. But I need for you to be safe.

 

Well, and having those discussions instead of just saying, you know, this is what's going to happen, you know, talking to the kid about, you know, how, how can we do this? So I feel like I'm protecting you and you still feel like you have, you know, some of your freedom or whatever. You know, it's a conversation. And I think a lot of parents feel like, you know, it's just all them making, you know, all the decisions and that there's no discussion about it. And I think that's where kids start, you know, pushing back when they're not seen and they're not respected and they don't feel like their parents have any clue who they are or what they're all about.

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

Well, and that's why I love involving the kids in the problem solving. Like, okay, so, you know, let's say if you were my teenager, I'm like, Anne, I really, for me, my, well, I have many jobs as a parent, but my number one is that you're safe. And right now, I'm not sure I can do that, frankly. You went to this party and drank, and then your friend drove home, I think they were drunk, I don't know. And now I'm just...

 

I'm second guessing all the choices. So when you ask me if you can go to the fair with your friends, I don't even know. What comes up for me is, oh my gosh, they're going to do this and this and this. And frankly, you end up in jail or overdosing in my head. So help me. What can I do? Right? Like what can you do to help me feel safer and I can help you have some independence? But that's a consequence of the decision you made. Now this is where we're at.

 

 

Ann

Yeah, yeah, that's great.

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

That's like a natural consequence, but then also let's problem solve.

 

Let them know those we forget to fill in the blank sometimes for them. We assume they know why we're making these decisions and they don't. And part of it is that's how we teach them to problem solve, to anticipate consequences and reactions to their decisions.

 

 

Ann

Yeah. So say what we're thinking out loud to them in a conversation rather than just making all, just having all this in our head and then out with the no.

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

Exactly. So for example, big one I see now is sending nude pictures, right? So you catch your child sending explicit pictures. Your teenager. First, check your own feelings because you're going to have all these feelings come up. And then oftentimes parents will say, no phone, no technology, no internet, no nothing, no friends, you're done.

 

Okay, that tantrums, it has a whole thing. There could be a consequence. Absolutely, I mean, it is not okay to do that and it's scary and it's child pornography and there's all these other things, right? They're putting themselves at risk. But really no cell phone, is that really, no, nothing for how long? We just have to be careful that we follow through with what we say. So instead, after the initial consequence, I'm like, hey, Anne, your behavior showed me that you are really not really thinking through some of your decisions. And when you send pictures that are explicit, you're not really protecting your body either or yourself. So, here's what happens. Now, once you send it, anyone can see your pictures. You think you sent it to Timmy. Now, this old man, you know, in Iowa might have access to your pictures.

 

It's out of our hands now. It's out of your hands because you sent that. That's one of my concerns. And you didn't think about that. So I'm concerned now about your decision-making. Another concern I have is that, you were hiding it from me. And then you can kind of start listing these concerns. And so now what do we do? My gut is telling me, my instinct is no internet forever. You're not ready. But I know that's not realistic.

Kids will have access to the internet no matter what you do. Right, so I know you need it for school. I know you're, so what can we do together? Can we check your Instagram? You know, can I be a friend, we look at it every night or you only use it in front of me? Or you and I have conversations every week about who your friends are that you're showing or we get you a flip phone. And you can have them come up with some suggestions.

 

 

Ann

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I think sometimes they do. Yeah, they come up with some pretty good suggestions, I think sometimes. Yeah.

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

Think about it and come back.

 

Oh, they're creative. Yeah, and you can say talk to your friends.

 

Ann

Yeah, see what they're doing. See what their parents are doing. Yeah, yeah. Well, so the other thing...

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

You're right, crowdsource. Yeah, but making it explicit why we're worried. We forget that, right? Why are we, because we get uncomfortable. We're worried that when you send pictures, you're not thinking about what actually is happening with those pictures. And you're only seeing yourself or your body, the value that you provide to anyone is your body and not anything else.

 

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

And that's really worrisome to me because I see the value you bring. And when you do this, it's showing me that maybe you don't. That's a very different approach than just like no phone, no nothing.

 

 

Ann

Yeah, yeah, we assume that they understand or they know what our concerns are. And so I guess then when we just take something away, we assume that they understand why we're concerned and they don't understand. And then they don't have any say in, you know, how they can solve the problem going forward.

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

Exactly. We need to help them to problem solve and think through their decisions because that's where their brain is not fully developed. Their prefrontal cortex is not fully developed yet. So really helping them walk through very explicitly. How do you know this person? You never met this person. How do you know Timmy is a 16 year old boy? I don't know. Could he? Oh yeah, he could be a 58 year old man in Iowa.

 

Eww girl, I've had these conversations with teenagers. They're like, eww girls. I'm like, oh no, he could and he could be doing x, y, and z with your pictures. Now I'm like, yes, explicitly this could be happening and now it's out of your hands. That's the decision you made. So let's write and really and not to scare them, but really to walk them through consequences of their decisions because they do think they're invincible and that's their brain. Yeah.

 

Ann

Yeah, we think they know these things. Yeah, and we think they know these things and they really don't and they don't think about the consequences. Before we go, I wanna ask you too about the issues that you're seeing that kids, adolescents are having these days. I mean, we know depression is off the charts, anxiety is off the charts. And right now I've seen tons of people talking about school refusal and school avoidance. What...

 

What are the things that you're seeing most of in your practice and through manatee and what can parents do right now when it is so freaking hard to get in to see? Not a therapist, but a psychologist or a psychiatrist or to get some real answers. What can we do?

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

That's such a great question. The first thing is educate yourself. So look online for reputable sources for what is anxiety? What is depression? What is suicide risk? How do I talk to my kid about suicide? One of the biggest concerns that parents have is if I ask about suicide, does that make it more likely my child will commit suicide or will think about it? No.

Let me say it again, no. We know research shows absolutely not. Actually talking about suicide is one of the best ways to prevent it, because it's showing that you're open to having these conversations. I guarantee you, your child has already talked about it with friends or knows people that have talked about it openly in front of them. So at Manatee, we have a free app, for example, that anyone can download, and it does have courses on anxiety. You'll see my face there, but they're all evidence-based. And...

 

And we also have some on suicide, how to talk to your kid about suicide. What questions do you ask? What do you do if you're concerned? Right? So those types of questions are really, really important to know how to ask and lean into your, you're going to feel uncomfortable. But pushing through that uncomfortableness is really critical for other resources, community. Right? You're mentioning adolescent parents feel, or parents of adolescents feel lonely.

 

We all, we're feeling really lonely. Kids are feeling lonely. Kids are over-scheduled and not connected enough. So remembering that, remembering the importance of having Sunday, like invite family over, or if you don't live close to your family or you're not close to your family, have some family friends, right? Invite some friends at chosen family. Create those extended networks.

 

that are going to be able to help you, right? Replenish your own social battery and your kids too. Because one of the big things about adolescence is the parent will no longer be that number one kind of, you know, I'm gonna tell you everything that's going on, but other adults can start being that. And surround your kid with great adults. Surround your kid intentionally with great role models and allow them to go hang out. You know, if they're safe people in your mind, yeah, sure, go take them to the park or go shopping with them or go to the skate park together and be okay letting go a little bit so they can start building those relationships. Because whatever those adults say, they're gonna hear it very differently than if you say it.

 

 

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

And you could do, you know, there's big brother, big sisters, there's in churches sometimes. It's also trusted adults, right? You said their key word, because we want to have similar values. We want to also be mindful of trust your gut. If something feels off, trust that gut. But we don't want to be super possessive of our child, especially not in adolescence. It's going to help them and help us if they can have strong relationships with other - Yeah, an aunt or uncle.

 

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

I wanted to add one more thing that I love asking, and it's crazy. So oftentimes I ask the teens that I work with, what was your mom like when she was a teenager? What was your dad like? And they have no idea. And I give them that homework. Go ask them. And when those conversations happen, and I see it the connection, the empathy that happens on both sides. Oh wait, mom, you weren't too, that you weren't gonna get boobs, and then suddenly, or your boobs are too, and guys, and this, and dad, you, oh, you wanted a beard, or you felt awkward, and you didn't make it into the basketball team too, and wait, what, you dated someone before mom? And those, right? It just really helps both sides connect with that. And what was it like to choose what you wanted to do after?

 

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

call after high school? Why did you make the decisions you did? Do you regret it? Those questions, if you could start having those conversations at the dinner table or when you're driving them somewhere, it will really build empathy and also you're teaching them. You could say, oh my gosh, I see now, I cared so much about being the cool kid when I was in high school that I thought I had great friends, honestly when I would, you know, I lost all of them because I realized they were not great friends at all and they didn't care about me. It was just a fun, sure we had great parties but that was it. And that was really sad for me. I wish I had friends from high school but I don't because I made some, you know, surface level friendships. How powerful is that instead of just saying, like, you should have friends that are deep and you should have friends that, you know, the shoulds don't work but really modeling and sharing.

 

 

Ann

Exactly. That's such a good point because parents and, you know, trying to remember and think back about how we were in high school and what we thought and what we were going through, I mean, that would build more empathy in the parent too. And then it lets the kids see that they're just plain old human and not, you know, perfect. How far would you go with that though? That's, you know, parents always wonder, should I tell them that I smoked weed every day before school? And that I was, you know,

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

100%.

 

Ann

partying and drinking.

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

Yeah, I wouldn't necessarily say that I smoked weed every day, but you could say...

 

That's a great question. I'm pausing to be thoughtful. Because it depends on each kid, right? It depends on each kid. If you have a kid that is not, that is really using drugs a lot or marijuana or what, then you could say, you know, I was really tempted by it too. And I wish I would have seen what it was doing. I would have understood what it does to the brain and the other opportunities it took away from me.

 

Ann

I know it is. I know. Yeah.

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

because that was not the only way to relax and feel good. I wasn't looking to have fun. I was looking to not feel the pain I was feeling.

 

 

Ann

Yeah. So being honest. Yeah, yeah, being honest about the thing. Yeah, yeah.

 

Dr. Mercedes Oromendia

but you don't have to go into detail. Without going, right? Yeah, or something like, do you have to tell them you slept around with everyone? No, you don't have to say that. But you can say, you know, when I was a teenager, when I was a teenager, I struggled to see my value besides the attention I got from guys. And I thought that was where my value came, depending how many guys liked me, that was.

 

 

Ann

I know a lot of us struggle with how much should we divulge about our own adolescence and are they going to throw it up in my face or think it’s okay because mom or dad did it. Well, as in everything else, honesty and transparency is the best policy, but you don’t have to talk details. Good to know, right?

So, let me tell you a bit more about Manatee, where Dr. Oromendia is the Chief Clinical Officer – and I’ll have the links in the show notes. Manatee is a virtual platform that provides therapy for kids, teens and families over 6 states and parent coaching throughout the US. They do really seem to understand that it’s the whole family that needs to change when a child or teen needs help.

Again, I’ll have all the links in the show notes for both Manatee and Dr. Oromendia’s private practice in Southern California.

 

Thanks so much for being with me today – that’s it for Speaking of Teens until Friday. I appreciate you hanging in there with me while my mother is on the mend and if all goes well, I’ll have a new episode for you in a couple of days.

Please join us in the Facebook group or if you need a more curated program with personal time with me, please check out Parent Camp. Both links are at the bottom of the episode description right where you’re listening.

Until next time, remember, a little change, goes a long way.